Scenes You're Most Excited to See

[Satsuma]

I would also rate the force field scene higher than the make out scene. It confirmed to everyone and herself how important Peeta was to her. It would be interesting to see if there'll be a switch into the game control room that may shed light on why the cannon didn't go off when Peeta's heart stopped. Would Plutarch play a part in waiting for the outcome of Finnick's rescue attempt, given he was aware of how important Peeta was to the rebel movement?

The brief stand off between Finnick and Katniss as they contemplated killing off one another would make a very tense scene. Given the battle was more in her head than anything Jennifer Lawrence's superb acting skills will come to the fore there.

That did seem to be a plot hole in the CF book, why the cannon didn't go off.  I think this may have been discussed on the old version of this forum, but I think that SC was thinking that the tracker chips detect signs of life, and trigger the cannons in some way, and that a tribute could appear dead, but not be completely dead.  A person's brain will continue to function for around 4-5 minutes after the heart stops, and if the chip can detect brainwave activity, then that would explain why the cannon didn't go off.  (Note that in the book, the D8 tribute girl's cannon didn't go off even though Cato and the other Careers assumed she was dead).

That being said, in the movie, the cannons do seem to NOT be auto-triggered, but require the Gamemakers to actively set them off, as Seneca tells his underlings to get the cannons ready, when he is trying to set up a confrontation between Katniss and the Careers.  Also, it is book canon that no cannons go off during the Bloodbath until it is concluded, even though I'm sure many of the tributes were completely dead, suggesting that Gamemakers need to visually confirm that a tribute is dead, even if the tracker chip information shows they are dead.

BTW, though I cut SC slack as she is obviously not a doctor, as someone who is trained in CPR myself, the idea that Peeta could have been revived with CPR alone, without an electrical countershock to reverse the effects of the electric shock that initially stopped his heart, or the injection of a medication to stimulate the heart, is actually NOT realistic at all.  Peeta bouncing back to his full self instantly, not even realizing that something had happened, is also totally unrealistic, though it does seem to the standard movie/TV depiction of CPR.  Part of me hopes they will at LEAST show them re-shocking Peeta, to avoid further contributing to the idea that CPR is the equivalent of a magic pill that will bring people back instantly with no ill effects. 

Gale's character will be much better defined in this movie. I can't help to imagine that his development will be like that of Anakin Skywalker, where his simmering anger will explode into outright hatred following his lashings. This will nicely set him up to be a real badass in the last movie.

Speaking of extra Gale scenes; I DO hope that either the end of the CF movie, or the first MJ movie, DOES show us the D12 bombing, and at least a glimpse of the horrors Gale saw, because to me, that experience, more than the whipping, is what sent Gale down the path of no return.  Gale himself uses the D12 bombing as justification for his plan to massacre everyone in the Nut.  I'd even accept the movie changing things a little so that the Capitol doesn't just bomb D12, but orders the Peacekeepers stationed in D12 to execute everyone, and have Gale actively fight them.  Or, if they really want to make Gale as dark as Anakin, have the Capitol cruelly abandon the D12 Peacekeepers to the same fate as the people, and having one of them run into Gale as s/he is trying to escape, and have Gale ruthlessly kill the Peacekeeper.  (Similar to the "Anakin massacring the Sand People" scene in the Star Wars films.)

[carolyn]

LOL... love the Anakin reference.   I'm also glad you brought up the attack on D12.  It seems like too many people missed the significance of this in relation to Gale's growing anger.  I know we're meant to like Peeta better, but I've never felt Gale was horrible, but very much misunderstood.

[lambstew]

One thing that impressed me most about the world of Panem is their advanced medical and genetic science. Horrific injuries could be healed at accelerated pace and with no leftover scars. You would think with the embedded tracking device they could accurately judge if a person is beyond saving or not. Foxface was declared dead seconds after eating the nightlock. Unless the fruits have unimaginably high toxicity surely her brain would still have some signs of activities when the cannon sounded. In fact, what constitutes death in the Hunger Games is not defined and, as in Peeta's case with the force field, seems to rest on the (subjective) judgement of the game officials.

Speaking of extra Gale scenes; I DO hope that either the end of the CF movie, or the first MJ movie, DOES show us the D12 bombing, and at least a glimpse of the horrors Gale saw, because to me, that experience, more than the whipping, is what sent Gale down the path of no return.  Gale himself uses the D12 bombing as justification for his plan to massacre everyone in the Nut.  I'd even accept the movie changing things a little so that the Capitol doesn't just bomb D12, but orders the Peacekeepers stationed in D12 to execute everyone, and have Gale actively fight them.  Or, if they really want to make Gale as dark as Anakin, have the Capitol cruelly abandon the D12 Peacekeepers to the same fate as the people, and having one of them run into Gale as s/he is trying to escape, and have Gale ruthlessly kill the Peacekeeper.  (Similar to the "Anakin massacring the Sand People" scene in the Star Wars films.)

From what we know of Gale's character he would be more affected by the sufferings of his compatriots than his own. So seeing his friends getting killed and his own family home burning down would leave a much deeper impression than his own lashings. Your scenario of Peacekeepers being sacrificed along with D12 is highly plausible though, given the cruelty President Snow is capable of. What a scene that would turn out to be!

LOL... love the Anakin reference.   I'm also glad you brought up the attack on D12.  It seems like too many people missed the significance of this in relation to Gale's growing anger.  I know we're meant to like Peeta better, but I've never felt Gale was horrible, but very much misunderstood.

No Gale is not Darth Vader. His strong emotions is transformed into proportionally strong actions. These actions carry devastating consequences, one of which affects the one person he vowed to protect.

[Satsuma]

Re the cannon question: The case of Foxface does also seem to suggest that the declaration of death is not automatic, but rests on the subjective judgement of the Gamemakers.  I'd also think that Gamemakers would be VERY leery of declaring a Tribute dead by shooting off the canon, only to have them wake up, as that would erode confidence in the Gamemakers, and likely lead to punishment for the Gamemaker.  (I suspect that at least one Gamemaker was made a fall guy and punished for what happened in Haymitch's Games as well.)  I can definitely see Plutarch using that as a cover reason for NOT shooting a cannon for Peeta; "Let's wait a little more!  We DON'T want to make a mistake, President Snow wants this year's Games to be executed perfectly!"  I wonder if this is another reason (in the books) that the bodies are taken away by hovercrafts, so that if a tribute does unexpectedly revive, it will be off-camera? 

As for Gale and Anakin, I think they do have some similarities, but Gale never quite falls to the "dark side" the way Anakin does; the THG universe does not have any such concept, anyway. Also, Anakin falls largely because of his possessive love for Padme, who he tries to keep alive even at the cost of killing innocent people.  I can't see Gale ever acting that way.  While I think he's mistaken, he simply does not see the Capitol and its allies, even the children, as innocent, whereas I have a hard time believing Anakin did NOT know that the Jedi "younglings", or the children of the Sand People for that matter, were innocent (and Anakin killed the Sand People for personal vengeance, not any righteous cause).

While I think SC meant for Gale to be misguided, and not the right fit for Katniss, I do not see him as a villain.  He is certainly motivated in part by vengeance, but he is not acting out of selfish ambition like Coin or Plutarch.  Gale SEEMS to be thriving in his new MJ role as a D13 soldier, but I think what he saw in D12 scarred him as much as the Games scarred Katniss and Peeta.  Also, he has only seen the negative side of the Capitol, since unlike Katniss, he hasn't actually spent any time there, or had quality time with people from there. 

I also think that Gale would have been willing to give Katniss up for the greater good, which is quite different than Anakin.  Indeed, you can argue that's exactly what he winds up doing. I also find it interesting how vague SC leaves his fate.  His winding up in D2 could be interpreted one of two ways.  One, that he went there as a conqueror, happily lording it over people he sees as morally inferior to himself, and ironically, turning into the same kind of oppressor that Thread was in D12.  The other, more hopeful option, is that everything that happened DID get Gale to question his actions, and that he went to D2 to redeem himself, and actually wound up feeling solidarity with the people he had fought against earlier.  Because if Gale wound up a "career soldier", he would actually have fit in quite well in D2.  Though that's assuming D2 continued to be the primary source of Peacekeepers; I can see Paylor's administration breaking up the Peacekeeper system, and actually letting the people of the Districts recruit their own police forces.

[Anchee]

That did seem to be a plot hole in the CF book, why the cannon didn't go off.  I think this may have been discussed on the old version of this forum, but I think that SC was thinking that the tracker chips detect signs of life, and trigger the cannons in some way, and that a tribute could appear dead, but not be completely dead.  A person's brain will continue to function for around 4-5 minutes after the heart stops, and if the chip can detect brainwave activity, then that would explain why the cannon didn't go off.  (Note that in the book, the D8 tribute girl's cannon didn't go off even though Cato and the other Careers assumed she was dead).

That being said, in the movie, the cannons do seem to NOT be auto-triggered, but require the Gamemakers to actively set them off, as Seneca tells his underlings to get the cannons ready, when he is trying to set up a confrontation between Katniss and the Careers.  Also, it is book canon that no cannons go off during the Bloodbath until it is concluded, even though I'm sure many of the tributes were completely dead, suggesting that Gamemakers need to visually confirm that a tribute is dead, even if the tracker chip information shows they are dead.
BTW, though I cut SC slack as she is obviously not a doctor, as someone who is trained in CPR myself, the idea that Peeta could have been revived with CPR alone, without an electrical countershock to reverse the effects of the electric shock that initially stopped his heart, or the injection of a medication to stimulate the heart, is actually NOT realistic at all.  Peeta bouncing back to his full self instantly, not even realizing that something had happened, is also totally unrealistic, though it does seem to the standard movie/TV depiction of CPR.  Part of me hopes they will at LEAST show them re-shocking Peeta, to avoid further contributing to the idea that CPR is the equivalent of a magic pill that will bring people back instantly with no ill effects. 

Electrical shock could trigger tachycardia, so the heart would still work, but the person could be unconcious, pulse is hard to feel or it's non-existent and the breathing is erratic and shallow too, if the person is breathing at all. So to a non-medic it would seem like the person is dead, while they're not. Yet, at least. And that could explain why the cannon didn't go off, because Peeta wasn't actually dead yet. Tachycardia can be fixed with just CPR if you catch it early, which they do in the book. I checked my theory with dr. Google and dr. Google agreed I'll check it with an actually doctor later when I come home but I think the theory is ok Running around after all of that isn't really realistic, but it could be explained with an adrenalin rush which happens when your survival instincts kick in. People with internal bleedings sometimes run around with their injury because the adrenalin keeps them going. When they relax they feel the full extent of the injury. This isn't super realistic, in real life reviving him and running around wouldn't go as smoothly as in the book, but all of this is possible. Though I don't know if SC really though about tachycardia, CPR and adrenalin rush, or just invisioned it the typical TV/movie way like you called it

And now, to be on topic (that's why I'm editing this for the third time ), I wanna see the scene when Katniss claws Haymitch's face. I think it will be toned down in the movie, but it would be awesome if it wasn't

[Ivana2804]

Electrical shock could trigger tachycardia, so the heart would still work, but the person could be unconcious, pulse is hard to feel or it's non-existent and the breathing is erratic and shallow too, if the person is breathing at all. So to a non-medic it would seem like the person is dead, while they're not. Yet, at least. And that could explain why the cannon didn't go off, because Peeta wasn't actually dead yet. Tachycardia can be fixed with just CPR if you catch it early, which they do in the book. I checked my theory with dr. Google and dr. Google agreed I'll check it with an actually doctor later when I come home but I think the theory is ok Running around after all of that isn't really realistic, but it could be explained with an adrenalin rush which happens when your survival instincts kick in. People with internal bleedings sometimes run around with their injury because the adrenalin keeps them going. When they relax they feel the full extent of the injury. This isn't super realistic, in real life reviving him and running around wouldn't go as smoothly as in the book, but all of this is possible. Though I don't know if SC really though about tachycardia, CPR and adrenalin rush, or just invisioned it the typical TV/movie way like you called it

Maybe they will be more realistic with it in the movie - which would easily solve the problem that many perceive with the fact that Peeta didn't lose his leg but will have to have problems running in the poison fog scene.

[Anchee]

I actually asked my mom who's a doctor about this. She said you can bring someone back by just CPR from tachycardia (even though it would be better with an electrical shock and drugs) and that that person could walk after it. That it would be like after waking up from fainting, only the person would probably be weaker than normal. My mom looked at me really strangely while I was asking her about short electric shocks and tachycardia and if you can run after it all

[Tash]

I wonder if this is another reason (in the books) that the bodies are taken away by hovercrafts, so that if a tribute does unexpectedly revive, it will be off-camera?

That is absolutely chilling, but I can very easily imagine that it could have occurred in a previous games.

Very interesting thoughts from all, thanks Anchee too for the medical information I think the bombing of D12 at the end of Catching Fire would be very powerful - imagine if that was happening at the same time as the arena was blowing up? We could see the force field blow and peacekeepers rush into D12 to quickly quell any "excitement", and as Katniss is lifted out of the arena cut back to Gale and what's happening on the ground and maybe see him injured and what looks like possibly being left for dead before returning to Katniss.

IMO every little piece of info just makes me more and more excited about all of the scenes in Catching Fire, I just can't fault anything I have seen to date. 

[Ivana2804]

I wonder if this is another reason (in the books) that the bodies are taken away by hovercrafts, so that if a tribute does unexpectedly revive, it will be off-camera?

That is absolutely chilling, but I can very easily imagine that it could have occurred in a previous games.

Very interesting thoughts from all, thanks Anchee too for the medical information I think the bombing of D12 at the end of Catching Fire would be very powerful - imagine if that was happening at the same time as the arena was blowing up? We could see the force field blow and peacekeepers rush into D12 to quickly quell any "excitement", and as Katniss is lifted out of the arena cut back to Gale and what's happening on the ground and maybe see him injured and what looks like possibly being left for dead before returning to Katniss.

IMO every little piece of info just makes me more and more excited about all of the scenes in Catching Fire, I just can't fault anything I have seen to date.

Wouldn't they need some time after Snow gives the order, after the forcefield is blown, to start the operation, fly the hovercrafts to D12 and carry the bombing? It would be weird to see those things happening at the same time, when the bombing should realistically happen a few hours after the blowing up of the forcefield.

[Satsuma]

I think the bombing of D12 at the end of Catching Fire would be very powerful - imagine if that was happening at the same time as the arena was blowing up? We could see the force field blow and peacekeepers rush into D12 to quickly quell any "excitement", and as Katniss is lifted out of the arena cut back to Gale and what's happening on the ground and maybe see him injured and what looks like possibly being left for dead before returning to Katniss.

Wouldn't they need some time after Snow gives the order, after the forcefield is blown, to start the operation, fly the hovercrafts to D12 and carry the bombing? It would be weird to see those things happening at the same time, when the bombing should realistically happen a few hours after the blowing up of the forcefield.

While I agree that the actual bombing likely took a few hours to pull off, if the movie tweaks the attack on D12 to include a ground force of Peacekeepers, including the ones already stationed in D12, I can certainly see that order (to execute everyone in D12 as a "traitor") being easily sent out by Snow via telephone, or perhaps a more sophisticated Capitol version.  So, the scenes Tash mentions could still occur, and be capped off with the actual bombing.

And while Darius as a "PK cursed with a conscience" may have been cut from the film, since (despite similar costumes) PKs aren't actually Clonetroopers programmed to carry out orders without question, I can see some being reluctant to carry out such an order, especially if they are ordered to execute children (you can argue the Hunger Games would have numbed them to the horror of killing kids, but what about kids not even old enough to be eligible, or even little babies?) 

I think there's a big difference between just pushing a button to drop a bomb, and personally shooting down people you've shared a small town with for years.  Although I guess showing PK's mowing down kids might be too much for the PG-13 rating; that being said, Katniss sees Capitol kids being shot down by rebels in MJ, even before the final bombing that kills so many.  Anyway, I can so see a scene in which a PK IS pointing a gun at a kid, hesitating to pull the trigger, but winds up being shot down by one of Gale's arrows.  If such a scene is done well, it could leave fans debating whether Gale did the right thing, or if he should have tried to talk the PK down.

[Ivana2804]

I think the bombing of D12 at the end of Catching Fire would be very powerful - imagine if that was happening at the same time as the arena was blowing up? We could see the force field blow and peacekeepers rush into D12 to quickly quell any "excitement", and as Katniss is lifted out of the arena cut back to Gale and what's happening on the ground and maybe see him injured and what looks like possibly being left for dead before returning to Katniss.

Wouldn't they need some time after Snow gives the order, after the forcefield is blown, to start the operation, fly the hovercrafts to D12 and carry the bombing? It would be weird to see those things happening at the same time, when the bombing should realistically happen a few hours after the blowing up of the forcefield.

While I agree that the actual bombing likely took a few hours to pull off, if the movie tweaks the attack on D12 to include a ground force of Peacekeepers, including the ones already stationed in D12, I can certainly see that order (to execute everyone in D12 as a "traitor") being easily sent out by Snow via telephone, or perhaps a more sophisticated Capitol version.  So, the scenes Tash mentions could still occur, and be capped off with the actual bombing.

If you will eventually just drop the bombs and destroy an entire district, why bother ordering executions before that? I always found the ending of CF so powerful because the fact that Capitol really can and does simply bomb an entire district and burn it to the ground, killing 90% of the population, shows the terrifying power of the Capitol, which is the reason why those people haven't rebelled for 75 years. (I've seen a lot of the "So why those cowards don't rebel?" questions by newbies who've seen the movie. CF reminds you why they didn't.) They used the fake bombing of District 13 to frighten people for decades, we got a hint that it wasn't true, but then at the end of the book they actually do just that with 12. Having Snow order executions instead would be watering it all down - it's something that people could actually try to fight against or hide from (in the first movie we've already seen people in 11 riot and fight with the Peacekeepers, and the incentive was less big than the prospect of everyone being executed), but with the way it happens in CF, it's a sudden death from air that you can't fight against and did not expect, and that's horrifying.

[Tash]

@Ivana - I agree the timing is a little off, but this is one of those occasions where I suspect there may be a little 'movie magic' in terms of things that seem to happen on screen at the same time (sorry, forum wouldn't let me Quote your post for some reason)

I also agree about the bombings being very powerful, but I am not adverse to giving Gale some screen time here (which I think we're all agreeing on anyway). Maybe the first plane comes over (direct order from Snow, given as the arena is coming apart) and hits buildings and in the confusion Gale rushes to help and is confronted by a PK? Or the film sticks to canon and the bombs are dropped and we just see Gale running around ushering people to safety. I can see a potential confrontation occurring if, say, the PKs have got some kind of bomb shelter and won't let normal citizens in - how terrifying would it be too if after that, Gale runs off and the next bomb lands on their shelter? Then the audience has the full effect of Snow meaning business.

It's certainly an "if this, do that" that's quite interesting to play out. At the end the net effect is the destruction of D12 and I'm sure they'll make that pretty powerful and horrific either way - the ending to Catching Fire is going to be pretty devastating!

[Ivana2804]

@Ivana - I agree the timing is a little off, but this is one of those occasions where I suspect there may be a little 'movie magic' in terms of things that seem to happen on screen at the same time (sorry, forum wouldn't let me Quote your post for some reason)

I also agree about the bombings being very powerful, but I am not adverse to giving Gale some screen time here (which I think we're all agreeing on anyway). Maybe the first plane comes over (direct order from Snow, given as the arena is coming apart) and hits buildings and in the confusion Gale rushes to help and is confronted by a PK? Or the film sticks to canon and the bombs are dropped and we just see Gale running around ushering people to safety. I can see a potential confrontation occurring if, say, the PKs have got some kind of bomb shelter and won't let normal citizens in - how terrifying would it be too if after that, Gale runs off and the next bomb lands on their shelter? Then the audience has the full effect of Snow meaning business.

It's certainly an "if this, do that" that's quite interesting to play out. At the end the net effect is the destruction of D12 and I'm sure they'll make that pretty powerful and horrific either way - the ending to Catching Fire is going to be pretty devastating!

Oh, I'm sure we will see the bombing in District 12 and that Gale's role will be substantial. They wouldn't miss the opportunity.

I also think we may get to see other things happening in Panem after Katniss blows up the forcefield, and before she wakes up in the hovercraft. This is when the rebellion/war breaks out. Those should be really dramatic, hectic moments. I can't wait to see how they do them.

[Satsuma]

If you will eventually just drop the bombs and destroy an entire district, why bother ordering executions before that? I always found the ending of CF so powerful because the fact that Capitol really can and does simply bomb an entire district and burn it to the ground, killing 90% of the population, shows the terrifying power of the Capitol, which is the reason why those people haven't rebelled for 75 years.

Ivana, while your arguments certainly make sense, I think that if the people behind the CF movie want to show us a glimpse of Gale's darker side, simply showing Gale "running around ushering people to safety" would not serve that purpose.  Inserting some kind of confrontation between Gale and a Peacekeeper, on the other hand, would provide such an opportunity.  (Also, Katniss doesn't ever tell us what happened to the PKs stationed in D12 during the bombing, and may not know herself, so a "Gale fights Peacekeepers during the D12 bombing" scene would be similar in terms of plausibility to the "Katniss honoring Rue inspires a D11 riot" scene in the THG movie.  There's nothing in book canon that definitely rules it out, since its plausible that it could have happened without Katniss knowing it did.)

I guess time will tell if the deconstruction of Gale is put off until Mockingjay, or if CF will show him as more than just a rebellious hero motivated by righteous anger.   

[carolyn]

I, personally, don't think the bombing of D12 was designed to show "Gale's darker side".  I believe it still demonstrated his goodness and strength that he set out to rescue the citizens rather than turn it into a personal vendetta to kill Peace Keepers, and by extenstion, fight the Capitol.  I think it's following the bombing, by finally being personally involved in the horror inflicted by Snow, that he then begins to give in to his anger.  It's in MJ that Gale's opinions truly become darker and he chooses to act upon them.